By Tim Rahn
What the Twins should do with Torii Hunter is a very tired topic. Everyone has his or her opinion. I, however, bring more than an opinion to the argument. I have developed a mathematic proof with this conclusion: keeping Hunter just doesn’t add up.
CF+P=HD
HD=HP
HP=BIftSMMT
Or for those non-mathletes amongst us:
Center fielder + Power = High Demand
High Demand = High Price
High Price = Bad Investment for the Small Market
Torii came up through the minors with the Twins. He was the face of the franchise and the rest of the nation’s only reminder that the Twins still existed for a number of otherwise nationally irrelevant years. Hunter has always been a good clubhouse guy, but he is fully aware that he is a big fish in a small pond ... well, WAS a big fish in a small pond. The pond is still small, but there are a few bigger fish in it…multiple Cy Young, MVP and batting champion sized fish.
So, how do we fix the Twins offense without keeping Hunter?
We can make up for Torii’s offense for a lot cheaper at third base. Troy Glaus, for example, is a year younger, with a career slugging percentage 30 points higher and is getting paid a little less than our center fielder. Glaus is cheaper in proportion to his stats because third basemen are expected to be good offensive players. And Twins fans always hear from Terry Ryan or whomever in the organization that Hunter’s above average production for a center fielder makes up for the lack of offense in our other typically offensive positions. Possibly true, but it comes at a price we don’t have the luxury of affording. Let me put it this way; we could have Glaus and Coco Crisp next year for a little bit more, if not the same price, Hunter could sign for. This is just a hypothetical situation, but wouldn’t a good offensive third baseman and a serviceable center fielder be a lot better offensive bang for our buck?
Oh, and I also worked out an equation for the “losing Torii’s personality variable”
NH = mMI (stYKes)
mMI (stYKes) = mCI
mCI < ItW
Or
No Hunter = More Mauer Interviews (suffering through “You Know” every sentence)
More Mauer Interviews (suffering through “you know” every sentence) = More Crappy Interviews
More Crappy Interviews < Important Than Winning
9 comments:
I think I have finaly come to the realization that the Twins are not going to be able to resign Hunter and that is sad for a couple of reasons. As I was sitting in the outfield enjoying a game last week I looked down on and around the field as the Twins were playing defense and I thought about how Torii Hunter was the only person out there who was a sizable contributor to the team that came within 3 wins of the World Series in 2002 (I know Johan was in the bullpen then). That was it, and that was just five years ago.
Its hard to grasp the kind of turn-over Hunter has seen in his tenure as a Twin and it is even harder to believe that the Twins have been able to remain competative throughout the emense turn-over. It speaks volumes to the type of system they are running but it sometimes makes it hard for fans.
I fully believe that last years team was the best squad the Twins have put on the field in my memory and I wonder just how long it is going to be before I will be sitting in the outfield and looking down thinking "Joe Mauer is the only player left from that awesome 2006 team." If I were in a possition of power within the Twins organization I would do whatever I could to keep Torii, and call me nieve but I think he would take less money to remain a Twin just like Kirby did over a decade ago.
He has been such a big part of this team for so long it would be difficult to see him in another teams uniform. I saw a kid holding a sign the other day at a Twins game that I thought sums this up very nicely, it read: "Mr. Pohlad, Torii is my Kirby."
well said, twinswin.
it is sad. the line between loving the player and doing whats best for the teams future is a tough one to walk for fans like us.
The twins have been competitive in every single one of toriis full-time seasons. they've made it to the playoffs 4 years and not 2 (soon to be 3)
i remember in '05 when mauer and morneua and bartlett and those guys all showed their faces for the first time. they were the exact opposite of the loud and proud '02 bunch. they didn't seem like they were having fun, and they felt like they had a right to play in the bigs. (said al newman about bartlett and morneau. that season and the young punky players frustrated al so much that he quit)
Torii punched Morneau in the face, and i was glad he did it.
Now Torii will be gone. Terry thinks he can re-sign him (thats why theres no chance we'll trade him even if we get swept outta cleveland this weekend), but he won't be able to. I've said this before and i'll say it again: some dumb team will give him 5 years for at least 15 mil/per. its not so much the money as it is the years. players around hunters age know that its about the years, cuz their productivity will drop within 2 seasons and they wont be worth as much. and the twins can't sign torii to longer than 3 years.
He was never an MVP or a batting champ, but he had personality and presence. Which is a lot more than you can say for our MVP and batting champ, as Soup pointed out.
I agree there is too much turnover/trading activity in pro sports. It is very hard for a fan to break the bond every year and take it season by season. A long time fan actually has to completely forget what happened 3,2 and sometimes even last year in order to enjoy this year. It sucks. Should teams show more patience? Is it fair to judge a player purely on his numbers? Probably not. I like to beleive the twins organization is aware of this, at least more than most. Trading sucks and this is coming from someone never to have completed a fantasy trade in any sport. (Player since '02)
I still like commons take. trade hunter and santana for a boat load of top tier prospects, and with all the up and coming starters in this organization, the twins could be rediculously good in time for the opening season in the new ballpark. But I agree with you all about hunter not getting traded. Buscher is two for two so far in his debut. atta boy.
I'm trying to think back, and this is probably worthy of a whole column, but when was the last time the Twins refused to pay the freight on their own superstar player?
The last one I remember off the top of my head is the Rod Carew time frame with Calvin. You can throw Bostock and Hisle in there, too.
Santana? 4 year extension.
Hunter? 4 (5?) year extension.
Radke? Signed him to that 4 year deal. And I think they re-signed him after that.
Knoblauch? Signed him. He didn't leave until he forced a trade.
Puckett? Signed.
Hrbek? Signed.
Gaetti was pretty much done.
Jack Morris - well, that's legitimate. But he voided his deal and I think McPhail was done with him.
Viola? As I recall, they paid up for him and only traded him later as a rebuilding move. I don't think that was money related. Again, I could be wrong about that.
I might be missing something, but during the Pohlad era, the Twins have a history of paying the necessary cost to retain their stars. If Hunter bolts, he'll be the first since at least Morris, and maybe the first one ever, really.
thanks for commenting John. thats a pretty good list.
i think it would be interesting to look at other teams pre-1995 biggish name free agents and see if they could re-sign them. This is just a guess, but i just feel like this is a different era economically. i'd bet that other teams pre-strike were able to sign more stars than post strike (especially among the smaller payrolled teams)
i'd love to see that column on twinsgeek.
yeah I am agreeing with haas, although that was a good point about previous stars. the twins even had one of the highest payrolls in baseball in the late 80s early nineties, but we have to keep in mind that when puckett resigned in umm 93 i think the year was? that was the highest paid contract in the history of mlb. and although i can't remember what the exact amount was, I know it was less than 5 million a year. Santana will require at least 20 milllion a year, hunter will require probably 15, and morneau will require something around 10 million a year. including everyone else on the team, that is like 1000 times the salary of the 87 twins.
The added revenue from the new stadium will help, but not in time to maintain hunter, santana and morneau. of those three the oddman out is definitely torii.
I'm not going to lie, and most of you know allready that I have never been much of a Torii backer. But, looking back over the past 5-6 years when he's healthy the team wins. I realize the future of the team is not Torii Hunter, and they would be smartest to trade him. But, I also realize I will miss him next year, and cheer extra hard against him and Derek Jeter when the Yankees come to town.
The thing that sucks is Polad has like one cazillion dollars. He is worth way more than even steinbrenner. I'm not asking the man to lose a whole bunch of money to make twins fans feel better, but I do feel like he could still make a profit after signing hunter, morneau, and santana.
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